On Dec 31, 2012, at 1:48 AM, Daniel Davala <daniel.davala@gmail.com> wrote:
Great thread guys, here are a few of my thoughts on the matter. When I started fly fishing in my early teens, I didn't even know what a tapered leader was. I had never heard the term "tippet", and X's were just something George Strait sung about that lived in Texas (I was quite the country boy back then with quite the mullet too). In fact, I'm glad I didn't know what these things were because it might have scared me away - I just wanted to try fishing with a fly rod, right? I did know I needed a leader though, so I just used a rod length of what I had a lot of - 12lb Berkley Trilene - red label. Why Trilene? Simple - because I liked watching Hank Parker (not Patterson) fish on TV in the 80's and he used it!Most of my fly fishing then was for Panfish and Bass, and some occasional streamer fishing for Trout on camping trips. Simply put, my 8' un-tapered leader of 12lb Berkley Trilene turned over my "Dial a Popper" Bass bugs and Black Ghost or Muddler Minnow streamers just fine. I caught plenty of fish and more importantly, I had tons of FUN! So if the question is, "can I use regular fishing line for leaders", the short answer is YES! That was how I started and it clearly didn't ruin my experience.One point of clarification on something Carl said earlier too, a leader does not actually "need" to be tapered to be a "leader". The term "Leader" simply refers to the length of monofilament line (be it nylon, fluorocarbon, gut, or any other applicable material) between the fly line and the fly. It can be long or short, tapered or not. A leader that has no taper is called a "Level Leader". A great and practical example is how we rig for Shad in the Spring, and for most sinking line work in general - with a 2'-3' un-tapered "Leader" of the appropriate breaking strength. Also, a 7'-9' un-tapered ("level") leader of 25lb test can work great on a floating line for Bass in thick lilly pads.SO THEN.........WHY EVEN USE ACTUAL TAPERED LEADERS AND FLY FISHING SPECIFIC TIPPET MATERIAL???????????????Well, if you only plan on fishing with large or weighted flies, hard body poppers, and heavy nymphs, technically you don't need to. The simple test is, if you can easily throw the fly you want to fish with at least a rod length away, then it has enough mass to turn itself over at the end of a cast, so a tapered leader is not required. BUT, there are definite performance benefits to using one. Besides turning the fly over, part of a tapered leader's job is to transition the energy of a cast from the fly line all the way to the fly. Ideally, the thicker butt section of the leader should be kept in close proximity to the diameter of the very tip of the fly line, so the energy transfer is as seamless as possible. Without that thick leader butt section, the fly line has a tendency to "kick" as the tip unrolls and can throw a shock wave straight down the leader to the fly causing it to smack down harder than intended or flop off-target. Also, when using and un-tapered "level" leader, you are just as likely to break off at the line/leader connection as you are at the fly, so you stand to lose the whole leader any time you snag or hang up on something. The thick butt section of a tapered leader is usually in the neighborhood of 50lb test, so it is likely you will only break off at the knot attaching the fly.If one fishes with a wide variety of flies, both in type and size (such as when Trout Fishing), then it is hard to be fully effective without a tapered leader and a wide range of tippet sizes. Most dry flies really need the help and design of a tapered leader to turn over well (fully extend) at the end of a cast. It is also important to keep the very tip of the leader, or "tippet" section diameter relative to the size of fly being used. When I go trout fishing in all but small streams, I carry with me spools of tippet from 0X-7X since I may fish a #2 streamer at one time, a #24 Trico at another, and anything in between over the course of a day. Carrying 8 small spools of "tippet material" is infinitely easier and lighter than large mix/match spools of conventional fishing line, and it allows me to conveniently build, modify, and rebuild my leader as necessary.The convenience of the smaller spools is also great when fishing locally on the Potomac. Most days on the river, at least when Striper fishing, I carry only a pair of forceps, some snips, a tippet spool of 16lb fluoro (or 0X), and a pocket sized box of Clousers. Hard to beat that kind of simplicity!And last, there certainly is a difference in quality/consistency when comparing mono-filament sold as "fly fishing tippet" to the large spools of conventional fishing line. Tippet sold as 0X-8X, for example, is graded on diameter, so the tolerances are much tighter and the diameter is the same from one end to the other. Bulk spools of conventional fishing line have a diameter range printed on the spool, so a 300yd spool of 8# test may have an acceptable diameter allowance of .008"-.010" from one end to another. That means even a good quality spool of regular fishing line can contain quite a range of diameters from one end to the other which really can impact not only your presentation with smaller flies, but also your tippet knot strength.Yes, spools of "tippet" cost a bit more, but most things made in smaller batches and held to higher quality standards do. Does it matter? One sip of the Woodford Reserve I'm enjoying as I type this certainly suggests so.In conclusion, you most certainly can use regular fishing line for a leader. It will work and it is not taboo. However, there are tangible reasons for the cost of "tippet material", performance benefits to tapered leaders, and pure functional convenience to the small spools. Hope this helps a bit and doesn't confuse.Dan DavalaOn Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 7:46 PM, Longley <matthew.longley@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks guys! Sounds like for anything delicate, I should stick to tippet, but I can pick up some spinning mono for salt and big fish.
Sent from my mobile deviceMost people won't go through 300 yards of any specific size tippet in their lifetime. Also considering the shelf life of some mono if it doesn't sit in an area with no direct sunlight, it usually is easier to just buy the spools of tippet. Most of mine last more than a full season.
And fishing 4x for tailwater midges just sounds silly.
R
Richard Farino
Urban Angler VA | 108 N. Washington Street 2nd Floor | Alexandria, VA 22314 <image001.png>
From: tidal-potomac-fly-rodders@googlegroups.com [mailto:tidal-potomac-fly-rodders@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Rob@robsnowhite.com
Sent: Friday, December 28, 2012 2:04 PM
To: tidal-potomac-fly-rodders@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: {Tidal Potomac Fly Rodders} tippet, leaders, and spinning line
Almost exclusively. Vicious, Berkeley vanish, and seagur (sp?).
I don't throw small flies that often. Ill have a spool of fly shop 4x for tail water midges.
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 28, 2012, at 2:01 PM, Matthew Longley <matthew.longley@gmail.com> wrote:Curious if anyone uses spinning line as a substitute for leaders or tippet. Is this fly fishing taboo? It seems about 10x cheaper, and for less picky fish I wonder if it makes a difference.
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